Now please before we start, this is not a Sting versus police thread and can we please not get involved with sting bashing or police bashing.I am not having a go at sting, but in my opinion he reformed the police because of the uncommercial success of Sacrd love.Many of you will point to Songs from the labrynth, and say that Sting is not bothered by commercial success.My opinion is that had sacred love sold as many as BND he would not have reformed police.I dont know sting, and only he knows the truth, but for 25 years he refused to reform the police, yet he reformed police after his worst sales of an original studio album.I am not threading this post to stir up trouble, i would just like to read your genuine opinions,and can we please have sensible disagreements even if you think that I AM TALKING RUBBISH.This question came into my head, after reading some other posts discussing SOUL CAGES and SACRED LOVE etc,And i think that as this is a website devoted to sting, then it is a very reasonable question to ask, without too many people getting precious about sting and taking the critisism personally.

There was the broken music thing in 2005-2006 before the police reunion , plus the luth thing (end 2006-early 2007) . I don't agree with you at all.
And in my opinion like Sting said , It was a good times to reform the police.
But now , the reunion is over and I think this is not so interesting to debate , we have done that so many times... :-)

Dom55 i take your point and respect your opinion even though i disagree with you.However i find this debate far more intresting then stings physique, or trudies organic food etc etc but thats just my opinion. I know the reunion is over and the police are unlikely to play together again, and of course it was a good time police to reform,but i still think the relevent poor sales of sacred love had a lot to do with it.If people are not intrested in this thread then please dont post, rather then coming on and saying this is not so intresting to debate.Please give a proper reason why i am wrong. ,because i might well be talking rubbish, which i am willing to accept.

I'd agree that Sacred Love was possibly one factor, of many, that led Sting to decide to reform the Police! Regardless of sales figures, I kind of got the feeling that Sting wasnt entirely pleased with Sacred Love, I remember him saying in a interview something like "it was the best I could do at the time", doesnt sound very confident!! Maybe he thought a stint with his old buddies would shake things up a bit in his solo career (I hope so)!! And im pretty sure money had a lot to do with it! A Police tour keeps Trudie and the bank manager happy whilst then giving Sting the freedom do whatever uncommercial music projects he likes!!

i believe there was three main reasons that sting finally agreed to reform the police for a one-off reunion tour.
1 - money. plain and simple. the big bucks were offered and the temptation was too much to knock back.
2 - andys age. it was basically now or never at the time. if it was left any longer andy would really have struggled with a near two year tour.
3 - the broken music tour. i honestly believe the reaction at concerts to the songs played finally convinced sting that the public - stings public - wanted more than anything to see the police live on stage again. the money generated proved this was the case.
there was probably tons of other reasons that convinced sting to do it and i will leave others to ponder but the fact that there was no new music from the band and the certain fact from sting that it is all over for the police convinces me that it was only ever going to be a one -off reunion and for that i shall be eternally grateful.
stevie

Kim Turner and Stewart's brothers deaths. Would also be a factor...

I'm agree with you Stevie with the 3 reasons but like I said , not especially because of Sacred love because the tour after ( broken music) was succesfull .
THe other 2 reasons are ok to my mind : It was the moment yes like Sting said.

Vila, interesting question. In my opinion, too many people are unfairly critical of Sacred love, both in terms of sales and quality of music. I thought it was a very strong album; in fact, I thought it was much, much better than Brand New Day. I saw Sting on the Sacred Love tour, and I can tell you that people enjoyed the concert. But, there must have been a reason why Sting didn't keep it going as long as, let's say, the BND tour. A hint of why the Police Reunion took place, I think, can be found on the Broken Music Fan Club CD. Dominic talks about how the "Sting machine" essentially imploded; everything was on "autopilot" and there was very little uncertainty involved on stage. As a result of this, the Broken Music Tour started, and then, as Stevie and others have said, based on audience response Sting realized if the reunion was ever to happen that was the prime time. Plus, I'm sure he was quite happy to be able to go to the record company and say: "Umm, that thing I said I was never going to do, I'm going to do it, so long as you pay me $---".

All this is just conjecture on my part, obviously. But I don't think the reunion happened because he thought Sacred Love sucked, or what-not.

If that was the case, he would have reformed them after Soul Cages, Soul Cages sold less than Sacred Love, much bigger flop. The fact is if Sting wanted to boost his ego, he would have taken the Broken Music concept to an album and an 18 month tour as it would have been a guaranteed success.

There is no law that states Sting is in violation of any law if he forms a band with just guitar, bass and drums. Unfortunately, for Police fans, Sting is breaking the law unless he forms that band with Andy and Stewart.

I would have loved to have seen that broken music tour,but i suppose i got an even bigger wish with the reunion.I think its fascinating to speculate his next original studio album, because no one is sure if its gonna be a rock album or an album in the same mould as BND or SL.Personally i hope its a bit more on the rock/pop theme.

stingfan24 you make a good point about sting being on autopilot during the sacred love tour.I have said in previous posts that the sacred love concert i saw in london,was the only time i have ever witnessed sting going through the motions.Maybe i picked a bad night to go and see him ,but he just did not look like he was enjoying it ,and the crowd were subdued as well in relation to previous sting tours i had seen.I also think that as sting approaches his sixties, that maybe it is time to shorten his world tours.To spend as much time on the road as he does at his age is incredible,but even sting as fit as he is must need to slow down a slight touch.Trini as i said at the top of the thread, this is not a sting bashing post,and there is no need to take it personally.No one has critisised him for doing the broken music tour,even without andy and stewart,and i for one would like to see a broken music type solo album as his next venture.

I will chime in too. It's a very good possibility that Sacred Love was the cause of the Police reforming. However, I don't believe it was because of sales. I don't think Sting was happy with it. I don't think it garnered the response he was hoping for. Even though he was confident at the time of it's release, I think separation from it changed his opinion.

I think he started looking for inspiration and decided to go in two separate directions to find it. 1) reforming the police and 2) Labyrinth.

Bottom line, I think it was more because of a lapse in creativity and possible doubting of his songwriting ability at his age in combination with an exploration of even more common & diverse styles of music at the same time, as well as a realization that everyone is getting older and the police reformation would be a "now or never" situation.

Plaster you make some very good points,along with lady dolphin who also said she felt sting was not happy with sacred love.At the time of the reunion, things got quite heated on this forum,and we never really had a proper debate on this subject,because people were too busy insulting each other,and I WAS AS GUILTY AS ANYONE OF THIS.I think now a year or two on people can give a more sensible ,balanced view without everyone having a tit for tat arguement.I think you could be right about sting,not being happy about sacred love,and not nessessarily just because of sales.Trini made a good point about sting and why did he not reform police after SOUL CAGES, but i feel this would have been too early into his solo career, and that it might have been regarded like his solo career had failed[I THINK SOUL CAGES WAS A GREAT ALBUM PERSONALLY]Maybe the best time to reform would have been after his next album TEN S TALES which was so successful, but i am not complaining as we finally got the reunion in the end ,even if it did take 25 years.

I don't agree either vila. I think he was going through a midlife crisis and decided to get nostalgic. When they found out how much money they could make then they really got excited. And Trudie wanted a new house.

The biggest mistake with "Sacred Love" is that they should have released the songs like they were on "The Inside The Songs Of Sacred Love" DVD. It was a huge mistake not to have a companion CD with that program. Most of us liked that much better. And the addition of "Like A Beautiful Smile", "All Would Envy" and "That Sinkin Feeling" would have made a big difference.

I also think that after the Broken Music Tour he knew it would work. Dom was very encourigng by telling him this is what he should be doing. He just didn't know it would lead to a Police Reunion instead of another leg of the BMT.

Frankly, I think Sacred Love was a good album but it would have been better had he not been distracted writing a book at the same time.

Thank you Trini. I agree with that totally. Just a little too techno for some people but the songs were good for the most part.

2 words: writer's block

Im also amazed by the choice of singles chosen by the record company.Singles are very important in the promotion of an album,regardless of if they turn out to be massive hits or not.For me STOLEN CAR andDEADMANS ROPE were the standout tracks on this album ,yet they releases SEND YOUR LOVE,WHENEVER I SAY YOUR NAME, which for me were not bad songs but really should have been just album tracks.Stolen Car could have been an outstanding song ,if only they had spent a bit more time working on the song.Have to agree with johnny that he did have writers block as well.Maybe after the success of BND he got a little complacent.

Sacred Love does have it's moments, but I agree about the writer's block. In addition, there were too many repetitve words and phrases, as well as too much synth bass and not enough real drums.

I don't know if it was complacency as much as it was an attempt to make a Brand New Day II. I could be wrong.

Either way, I hope his time with the police and the lute tour has inspired him. In retrospect, I appreciate and respect Sacred Love, but honestly, I'd rather have no new album than another Sacred Love.

Plaster you make a good point.I have also made the point in a previous post .that sacred love was an attempt to make BND2.Send your love ,was obviously released to try and recapture the success of Desert rose.This website is obviously gonna have sting diehards who love sacred love, but i along with you would rather have no new album then another sacred love.I would not nessessarily agree with franny ,that it was too techno,but as a dedicated sting fan i just found the album very bland and disappointing compared to the other solo albums he has made.Once again ,its just my opinion.

Not that I would agree with placing the blame squarely on Sacred Love for the reformation of the Police, I do happen to agree with the opinion that the lackluster reaction to Sacred Love and the subsequent tour did lead to the writer's block which lead to a period of stasis which caused Sting to continue to stall creatively - seeking out any possible project in order to aid in the avoidance of getting down to business of composition - and this enabled the opportunity for a reunion to take place. (whew! all that verbage in one sentence- yikes!) What occured was a chain reaction - a domino effect - and the result was oh so dreadful :)
But I must stick up for Sacred Love in some respect. Though it's easily recognized as Sting's most inconsistent release, in my opinion, there is actually some high quality material on there. Songs such as 'Inside', 'Like A Beautiful Smile', 'Dead Man's Rope', 'Never Coming Home' (specifically the 8 minute version which includes Rebello's extended soloing) and 'The Book Of My Life' are all worthy additions to his discography. And even if I'm normally a muso purist, I don't even mind the overabundance of programming which dominates the disc. It surely seemed as though it was a product of it's time. Sting attempted to incorporate a bastardized hybrid of hip-hop styled rhythms into his own unique flavor of pop - plus mixing in additional elements of Middle Eastern music on various tracks. Sacred Love surely wasn't a grand success but I cannot view it as an overall failure. At the proper times, it is still good music to my ears.

It seems the general artistic consensus here, I think, is that Sacred Love had some good music but overall was overly programmed.... if Sting had allowed more artistic expression it might have done better. I agree with most everything said here, but would only point out that the recorded music industry is generally in the krapper these days. All of the major acts today.... U2, Springsteen, Coldplay, Madonna, Keith Urban, Joel/John, the Stones, Clapton/Winwood, Petty, etc. etc...... are seeing diminished record sales and an increased emphasis on performing for their income. I heard a radio interview recently with John Mellancamp in which he admitted that he now allowed his music to be used in commercials and in Muzak because of his general inability to get critical radio play to sell albums. Whatever motivated Sting to reform the Police.... probably a combination of factors.... there's no doubt the money was key.

STing refomred the police because sacred sucked, he wants more money, nothing tops a Police reunion, Kipper sucks, and writer's block. The right money comes around again he will reform the Police and continue to treat andy and stewart like crap

and to think the discussion was going so well, until.... :)
who put on the broken record???

anyway, it is indeed reasonable to conclude that had Sacred Love been as successful as Brand New Day, then Sting would have most likely gotten back right away to work on another solo cd. instead, he took a detour called the Broken Music Tour and then another detour with the Labyrinth project and then another detour with The Police reunion. and it is entirely feasible to link it all right back to Sacred Love. so for the die-hard Police fans, shouldn't you all totally love Sacred Love now - if only for that? :)

Yeah, and what a broken record it is! Very sad actually.

Anyway, great thread of posts, minus the minor, insignificant hiccups, that is.

I agree with you bathology, that there are quality songs on Sacred love, and sometimes I wonder if I'm still not getting it completely. I wonder if it is maybe still ahead of my time too, and maybe I haven't caught up with it.

I too love the 8 min "never coming home".

Whatever happens, I will buy the new disc when it is released. Even though we don't have a clue what it will sound like, I'm certain that there will be many significant threads of wisdom on it. Which is all I can ask for.

Im not kicking a man while he is down ,because he has taken a hell of a lot of stick on this site, but i really hope KIPPER has no imput on the next album.He is obviously a talented artist,as sting would not be working with him,but i would love HUGH PADGHAM to return to the fold ,and produce the next record.

IF and its a big IF he works on the album it I hope will only be playing keyboard IF that.

As noted this threads a Broken Record Tour. They being the Police reformed and I don't honestly care why it happened.

David sancious and Vinnie with him and Dom in may in Chicago : that's fabulous news!!!

Gonefishing ,i dont think this threads a broken record tour.There have been some quite good responses to my question,but like i said we are all entitled to our opinions.

I disagree on this; to say he went back to The Police because of SL.

The Police Reunion was something that had been building on itself regardless of what Sting was doing. The more he pushed it off, the larger it became. He just decided to it when everyone else had mostly given up on those prospects and did it when everyone least expected. Still, it was building.

No doubt, SL was a part of a series of events in his decision process that made the Reunion more palatable to him, but I don't think it was the Catalyst.

The question now is how will he leverage the Reunion to benefit his continuing solo career? I think coming back in with this CSO Show line-up make a strong landing. Let's see where it goes from there!

Sport, im hoping this is the line up for the next studio album, but with sting you just never can tell.

broken record indeed, same old little annoyances trying yet so hard,
trying to leverage the reunion to STing's benefit is like hoping for rain after a rain dance

Just going off subject, MICRA if you are still looking at this website,PLEASE COME BACK.For me, you are my favourite on the whole of the site,and you are a true fountain of knowledge.Your views are always balanced, and stingus without MICRA is like police without sting.Come back MICRA you are the NO 1.

Continuing on the MICRA theme, i did not realise there had been an arguement between MICRA and MUNCH until i read the thread about THE WILD BORE this morning.I know in the past when i have had disagreements with others[including MICRA]i have said things in the heat of the moment,without thinking that i hurt the feelings of the other person,and i have threatened to leave the site but have always come back.MICRA you and MUNCH obviously have strong feelings on this matter,and you are both entitled to your opinion.Having seen some of MUNCH previous posts,i think he has always made some useful imput into the discussions.There are always gonna be disagreements,thats life, and when two people are passionate about their own beliefs ,it can sometimes lead to fricion.Right ,i have done my MOTHER TERESA bit for the day.Come on MICRA, come back because we all miss you ,and im sure that deep down you miss us ,even if some LIKE MYSELF irritate you from time to time.

Really good discussion here, everybody!

I must say, I am feeling very much in the minority here when I say that I love Sacred Love! I do agree, however, with the general consensus that the album's commercial shortcomings and the subsequent world tour did contribute to some writer's block and plenty of distractions for Sting, which culminated in the Police Reunion.

That being said, though, the more time passes, the more I'm amazed at the commercial success of BND, which I thought was Sting's worst album by far. It contains my favorite song of all time, A thousand years, and it does have a few other solid track on it, but a large portion of the album is just not that good, especially by Sting standards. I mean, if one is to compare BND vs. Sacred Love song for song, I think Sacred Love comes out on top by a landslide! But that's just me, I guess.

The new line-up has me very excited! If it's any indication of what Sting's frame of mind is now, I'm liking it a lot. The last bit of info is who the next producer is going to be...

It's not the arguements and disaggreements, it's the way some people make themselves seem superior to others. We can all disagree but no one is more intelligent than any of us on here. We just think differently. And thats what makes the world go round. Micra had enough.

It's definetly not the extremists bats flying over out heads here. It's people that you respect but then dissappoint you with insults that are not necessary.

And I loved Sacred Love too stingfan and we are definetly in the minority.

SPORT ,i agree with you on the success of BND as i also thought it was not one of his better albums.I think song for song sacred love was probably as good as bnd.I think the two differences for me ,on why bnd did better was the jag advert.The second reason was that the singles were so much stronger.Thousand years was a great song,but we also had brand new day,desert rose and after the rain has fallen, which for me were far stronger and commercial then the singles chosen for sacred love.

stingfan24, my last post was meant in reply to you,and not sport.Sorry i must have been daydreaming at the time.

Villa in a follow-up to my "Broken Record Thread". My response was a short version of very long post I had started and thankfully (to me at least) closed my browser instead of hitting submit.

I'm right now fighting with "depression" that has built itself up over the last 20 years but has been accelerated over the past 7 months. Losing a job that I had worked for 19 years is only the smallest part of the iceberg. My mothers passing in 2004 - an issue I have refused to deal with (gee who else do we know that had troubles dealing with loss). My dads own health issues and his stubbornness (which we have no control over) may play a part but only a small part if that. I took my rant to my councilor session the other day. She called it a break through. She said I had finally let it out rather than keeping it in as I always do.

---going totally off topic and hijacking the thread, I’m pretty sure I’ve done that before---
In September things were looking up for me. A year ago I had submitted some work to a publisher and they have been responding favorably but had rejected it. With the help of someone in the cartooning field I plodded onward and submitted again. This time the submission was received and a contract was offered. My cartoon was slated to be released at the end of this month assuming all things had played out correctly.

In November of 2008, as I may have stated before I was stuck by a car while crossing the street on my way to a temporary job stocking shelves at a grocery store. The store is about 10 minutes from my house and is in easy walking distance and I decided to walk to work. The car ran the light hitting me losing control and then plowed into a bus stop. I bork a leg in two spots, my head hit the window frame and I "broke" the guys mirror.

For what little I remember he was more worried about his cars damage and the busted mirror than the head injuries his passenger suffered. Stupid thing is the police let the guy go with no charges made at the time. No drivers license, no insurance, illegal immigrant who has decided he can’t speak English but was able to say I damaged his car pretty clearly.

As an end result I now have short term memory issues (wee what fun that is). Especially the hide and seek half... put something down and 2 minutes have no clue where it was left. I hate taking notes and can't read my own handwriting which only got worse after the accident. If I had written this three months ago I’d probably forget that I wrote it. Now if I post it the only thing I may do is regretting posting this post.

Thanks to the accident and memory issues my cartoon career has been temporarily permanently obliterated. I can't draw a straight line to save my life now (not that my straight lines were straight before but Charles Shultz drew a better circle at the end of Peanuts that I can right now ;-).

Anyways enough of that pity party for one.

In my prior post after thinking about that fact that a friend's sister is sitting in a hospital dying (head injury) and the fact that another friend's neighbor had committed suicide (No outward obvious signs either - boy that House episode hit a nerve for me)... I had commented who really cares why the Police reformed, and why the big issue over it when there are other things to get worked up over. Like work, or hobbies, or family.

So when somebody (not you) goes about and posts like they have/had I finally snapped. At least all I said was the short version of my rant – Broken Record Tour was a heck of a lot better than what I first wrote but didn’t send.

As I said before: I liked Sacred Love, Love the Lute Thing, Appreciated the Police reformation and look forward to Stings next project whether its Olives, Lutes, Police, or Solo. And at least he gets to do something I can’t and will be able to recall it later on without a boat load of notes….

stingfan24 I have your exact opinions on Sacred Love - I LOVE it lol.

but like vila465 - I wouldn't want ANOTHER SL-type album either.

but Sting IMHO has never made one album like the other. Some people say that SL was like BND part 2 but I don't know - not for me. I NEVER could get into BND, but I definitely am drawn to SL in a way that I am definitely NOT to BND.

Well said Gonefishing. I also feel the same loved it all, will love whatever may come.

Yes and we all have trouble dealing with loss. Especially when we can't understand the whys's of it all. I too had to finally seek counceling for the loss of my son last July. I never thought I would do that, (didn't do it when my husband died)but it has helped.

Keep your courage Gonefishing and keep your head up high taint easy but our families need us too. That can give you a goal.

I am so sorry about your memory loss. I have that too only mine is brought on by age. You are still young. Heres hoping for a better future for you and yours.

Not to me either Shazia. Totally different concepts. Hoping for something exciting.

Gonefishing there was no reason to explain,and hopefully things will start to look up for you.